D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Canon T3i / 600D, 60D, T2i / 550D, 1D Mark IV, 7D, 5D Mark II.
Panasonic DMC-GH2.
Nikon D7000, D5100, D5000, D90.
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Doughie
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D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by Doughie » 29 May 2010 17:50

Very interesting comparison here on all kinds of techincal aspects of the latest videoD-SLRs versus classic 35mm film stock.

Check out these 3 videos :

DSLRs vs 35mm film, Episode #1 :
http://www.vimeo.com/11080239

DSLRs vs 35mm film, Episode #2 :
http://www.vimeo.com/11082700

DSLRs vs 35mm film, Episode #3 :
http://www.zacuto.com/shootout
(see appropriate link on this page above)

Plenty of interesting comments there.

chrishull3
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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by chrishull3 » 11 Aug 2010 09:39

Well i have to say that i am dissapointed that the 550D i own cant match HDV footage from my HV30 in the sharpness resolution dept,i think comparison with 35mm film is a bit ott.

chrishull3
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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by chrishull3 » 26 Sep 2010 16:34

THIS 5D/7D FILM LOOKS GOOD FOR SURE, I AM HAPPIER WITH MY LITTLE 550D NOW.
http://vimeo.com/15225915

noa
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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by noa » 26 Sep 2010 22:55

You made that film chris? Some nice looking footage there. I think many first time users of 550d or 7d alike camera's are a bit 'dissapointed' at first because I too saw that my xh-a1 had finer detail in the image, I also got really awefull moire in my image once on a brick wall in the background but once I got 3 sets of lenzes (a 50mm 1.4, a 28mm f2.8 and a wide angle (11-22) then I could see the real benefits getting some shots my xh-a1 was not capable of, like shooting in very low light situations or trying to capture something wide in a very narrow space. A dslr has limitations, that's for sure, but if if you try to avoid those limitations you can get some great footage out (and also very nice colors). Must say that dslr's are very difficult to operate but well worth the time if you want to set your self apart.

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Doughie
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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by Doughie » 27 Sep 2010 04:53

chrishull3 wrote:THIS 5D/7D FILM LOOKS GOOD FOR SURE, I AM HAPPIER WITH MY LITTLE 550D NOW.
http://vimeo.com/15225915
Hi Chris - just curious as to the reasons you are happier with your 550D now. Have you changed the profiles you are using or made some sort of breakthrough?
I agree with noa that these these are not for-every-man and it's certainly a more demanding way to shoot than a regular videocamera as they're of course principally designed for stills. No use for the reflex mirror at all in video mode on a D-SLR. I think the cheapness of them, big sensors and the massive variety and relative cheapness of so many lenses make them appealing. I agree too that its just another tool - gives a different look. Meaning don't use a D-SLR in a situation where an XH-A1 will get the required shot easier, better and with less effort.

noa - what editor do you use for 550D footage? just curious, am not trying to hijack the thread.
Also how long did it take you to get it figured out for video, meaning profiles, settings, etc. I am considering a 7D or 60D maybe at some point, though not right now.

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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by chrishull3 » 27 Sep 2010 08:52

No Noa thats too good even for me [joke]Dougie i never disliked the 550D but yes i have all the settings to my liking now and i get some great footage from it, i still dont have a hoodie and focusing in the sun is the biggest pain, i tried a hoodloupe but sent it back as it was not for me, one thing i have found is pans must be left to a minimum and let what you are filming do the moving.

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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by noa » 27 Sep 2010 08:57

I am a long term adobe user and stopped a version cs3, waited a bit to see what cs4 was all about but when I read about it being unstable and bloated I didn't upgrade, then cs5 came along but also my first 550d footage that premiere cs3 couldn't read so I had to make a decision.
Buying cs5 would mean buying a new pc as it required a 64bit system but cs5 needs a spaceship computer to get the most out of it, adobe software is very expensive in Europe to buy/upgrade and getting a new pc as well would be quite expensive.

Just at that time canopus edius pro came with a crossgrade for non canopus owners and I could buy edius pro 5.5 for 190 euro (normally it's 750 euro) without the 3th party software but I only needed an editor. As much as I like working with premire cs3 it's not a very stable version, I use a Sony hvr-dr60 drive with my Canon xh-a1 and that creates about 300 files per wedding i do. Premiere just chokes in those, I used a seperate software to first combine all these seperate files into one big file and then it was no problem anymore. Edius on the other hand eats small files for breakfast, especially dslr footage which import very quickly and I can almost 1 track edit natively on my 3 year old Q6600 processor machine. I only can't scroll smooth but playback is about 90% speed, sufficient for very rough cutting to get most of the junk out, then I export to canopus HQ avi and use that file for color correction, once color corrected I export as avi again and take that avi file into premiere for the final edit including sound. That file I export to a mpeg2 1440x1080 ,25mbs and then I use tmpgenc for further transcode to dvd compliant files.

Reg my 550d, I shoot as flat as possible so I can get the look I want in post, I choose a "neutral" setting for this reason, I also always set the white balance in the camera (never "automatic" because it doesn't do a good job at guessing.) I might experiment more soon to get the contrast down as well because now it's still difficult to match with my xh-a1, it's possible but I have to add quite some contrast and saturation in post to get that same look on my xh-a1.

To prevent problems with matching up now I only use a extra Sony HDR-XR520V handycam in church f.i. and that one matches up much easier, the 550d I only use for dark receptions or when doing events (where I have more time to set up) Some weeks ago I used the 550 almost exclusively during an event (maybe 10% xh-a1 during speeches) and i was very happy with the result (my client could believe I did it with that small camera i was carrying around.:)

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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by noa » 27 Sep 2010 12:14

noa wrote:(my client could believe I did it with that small camera i was carrying around.:)
that should be "could not believe" :)

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Doughie
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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by Doughie » 27 Sep 2010 20:05

thanks noa for that.
Focussing on 550D been ok? You mainly using it for locked-off shots on tripod? Or are you using it handheld? Focussing i think is such a critical issue with these things. I have a XR520V too, and i should be able to borrow a 550D soon, so that'll be interesting. Until then, my D90 will do if i need wideangle video wider than the approx 34mm my XR520 (with 0.7x WA attachment lens) can manage.

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Re: D-SLRs vs 35mm film

Post by noa » 27 Sep 2010 23:51

I have 3 lenses at my disposal, a nikon 50mm 1.4, a 28mm 2.8 and a canon 11-22 f3.5-4.5

For the wideangle lens from canon I can use the autofocus by pressing the photobutton slightly until the white square in the viewfinder turns green meaning you have correct focus on that spot, it works very good in getting accurate focus quickly. It's also the only lens I have that can be used handheld but only when the lens is at it's widest. (11mm is already very wide, even with the 1.6 cropfactor, much wider then my xh-a1)

For the nikon lenzes which I use with an adapter it's all manual, there i always use the magnifying button which zooms in considerably making focusing a breeze, without that I'm not able to nail it exactly. The dof is so narrow, especially on the 50mm at f1.4, that even when you think you got it and when you magnify the image, you often see your slightly off.

Both 50mm and 28mm are absolutely not possible to film with handheld, for me that means always on a tripod.
I also use a fader nd filter (nd2 up to nd400) on the nikon lenzes to control the incoming light, works very smooth. For the Canon wide angle lens I can let the camera control the iris but I choose not to and dial it in myself, it does mean more preparation before you can make the shot but it's also the reason why i use the camera only for creative work where I have to the time to do all this.

You can see below the first job I did with the 550d where I almost used it exclusively, the only images that are not from the dslr but from my xh-a1 are when you see the 2 people speeching, the image of the cake and when you see that big group sitting together, in that shot I needed a controlled iris adjustment as there was a bright spot on the toppart of the group and I needed to show the people that were sitting in the dark as well :) , all the rest is 550d footage. I realy loved the use of the wideangle here as I could capture the eventhall in one shot. Everything you see is ungraded (only the xh-a1 footage is graded just to match up better)
I was quite pleased with it and so was my client :) - just click on the play button to start the film.

http://www.noafilm.be/company-party/

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