Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

HDR-FX1000 / HVR-Z5 (2008). HVR-Z7 / HVR-S270 (2007). HDR-FX7 / HVR-V1 (2006). HDR-FX1 / HVR-Z1 (2004).
gedion4000
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Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby gedion4000 » 20 Sep 2011 04:13

i recently watched a couple videos on cinematography and color correction and one of the tips that was given was to shoot a "Flat Image". not sure if that's a common term but they referred to it as knocking down your cameras contrast and saturation in order to preserve the information in the high lights and low lights so you can adjust it in the color correction or grading later on.

ok so on to my question. how the heck do i do that let alone how do i do it with a HDR FX-1 i went through the menu and the only thing i can think of is the gain setting. i cant find anything about this on line so I'm asking you guys.
any ideas?

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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby acgold7 » 20 Sep 2011 07:32

This is where PICTURE PROFILES are your friends. Go to the section in your manual that describes them and play with them a bit. Play with CINEMATONE GAMMA, which softens the color curves.

The FX1 doesn't have a lot of controls in this area but does give a very lovely picture. There's not a lot of tweaking you can do, but on the upside there's not a lot you need to do.

Use your zebras to make sure you aren't blowing out your highlights.
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Stephan
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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby Stephan » 20 Sep 2011 08:03

Black Stretch (expands the shadows) and Knee (expands the highlights) in a custom Picture Profile, to flatten high-contrast situations.

Although I seem to remember that Knee only came with the V1, not the FX1 - or is that Black Stretch instead?

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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby Doughie » 20 Sep 2011 17:02

Stephan wrote:Black Stretch (expands the shadows) and Knee (expands the highlights) in a custom Picture Profile, to flatten high-contrast situations.

Although I seem to remember that Knee only came with the V1, not the FX1 - or is that Black Stretch instead?

Yes, I am 90% sure that 'Knee' did not come as a feature on the FX1.

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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby acgold7 » 20 Sep 2011 18:56

Nor did Black Stretch.

Trust me, guys, none of these are on the FX1... I had three of them, and double checked the manual last night... it has no advanced picture customizing features other than Cinematone Gamma. The Z1 had them but not the FX1. I was a little surprised, as we have become so accustomed to the pro features migrating down to the prosumer siblings, with each successive model. The FX1000 is remarkable in this regard, with so many of the pro features of its pro sibling the Z5, but the FX1 was the first generation and there was quite a gulf between it and its sibling the Z1. I have a PDF showing something like 40 firmware features distinguishing the Z1 from the FX1, but we can't attach those here.

But chip and optics were thankfully the same.
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Stephan
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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby Stephan » 20 Sep 2011 23:09

acgold7 wrote:The Z1 had them but not the FX1. I was a little surprised, as we have become so accustomed to the pro features migrating down to the prosumer siblings, with each successive model.
Got me! I stand corrected :-)

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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby steve » 21 Sep 2011 00:11

The FX1 was released some three months before the Z1, so I imagine that the professional division tweaked the locked-down firmware of the FX1 to make it a viable pro product. I bought my FX1E in January 2005 at the London Video Expo where Sony were launching the Z1. I got a Beachtek DXA4 thrown in - there were many pros buying them as the Z1E wouldn't be generally available until March/April.
Still a nice camera to use, everything in the right place but picture a bit soft by current HDV standards.

Steve

gedion4000
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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby gedion4000 » 21 Sep 2011 19:11

steve wrote:The FX1 was released some three months before the Z1, so I imagine that the professional division tweaked the locked-down firmware of the FX1 to make it a viable pro product. I bought my FX1E in January 2005 at the London Video Expo where Sony were launching the Z1. I got a Beachtek DXA4 thrown in - there were many pros buying them as the Z1E wouldn't be generally available until March/April.
Still a nice camera to use, everything in the right place but picture a bit soft by current HDV standards.

Steve
I have notices it has a huge lack of light sensitivity too. The slightest bit of low light and im all grain. i took it for a run in my back yard last night about sundown. everything looked good till i looked at the shadows.

gedion4000
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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby gedion4000 » 21 Sep 2011 19:13

thanks guys. i haven't had much time to play with any of the profile settings and to be honest i didn't know anything about the cinematone gamma or what it did. but i will do a little work with the camera later on today. ill be sure to let you know how everything came out.

Thanks again.

gedion4000
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Re: Shooting a flat image with an FX-1

Postby gedion4000 » 23 Sep 2011 08:49

alright, today i went out and did a couple test shots with the FX-1 to see what i could come up with and see if anything came across any better. this video http://youtu.be/ZXlY-zDBiJo is the best i could get. it was shot using these settings.
AE RESPONSE: MIDDLE
WB PRESET: OUTDOORS
GAIN SETUP: 15dB(keep trying to knock it down but it always reverts back to 15dB)
........................

PICTURE PROFILE SETTINGS
COLOR LEVER: -7
COLOR PHASE: 0
SHARPNESS: 15
SKINTONE DTL: OFF
AE SHIFT: -1
AGC LIMIT: 12dB
AT IRIS LMT: MIDDLE
WB SHIFT: 0
CINEMATONE GAMA: OFF
CENEFRAME: CENEFRAME30


I imported the video using firewire into adobe on location(would have used premier but it wouldnt capture in HD for some reason) as an AVCHD clip. it imported as 1440x1080, screen aspect ratio at 1.78 and pixel aspect ratio as 1.33 at 29.97fps, codec MPEG2(192MB), freq 42000 and 2 channels. and rendered out of after effects(wanted to try stabilizing it) best settings, lossless and as .m2v
i know youtube isnt the best way to show quality in a video but look at it, it still looks bad. my super8 camera i had back in the day does just as good. theres no sharpness to the image, all the lines are fuzzy and the dark areas are still grainy. do you guys have any idea whats going on here? import settings? bad firewire? crap camera? id hate to think i have a HDV camera thats stuck in the 90s as far as quality.


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